| |
Main
Date: 06 Aug 2006 22:43:35
From:
Subject: how can I improve my Long run.
|
I am training for Marine Marathon. For long runs I am currently running
16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around stone mountain.
I almost drag myself, walk a lot after 12 miles. My goal is to run at
least 5 twenty miler by the end of September.
The course is mostly concrete and with some small climbs.
What can I do to run at an even pace till the end. I am 185 lbs. My
long runs are at 12 mins/mile. Any advice?
|
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 07:48:04
From: 26.2
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Mark
It takes me about 1:17 to 1:30 for each 8 mile loop.
My intervals are 800X10 @ 4:30 for each 800 and my tempo pace is about
10 min/mile. With a mile of warm up and a mile of cool down.
My weekly total was 29 miles last week.
According to Bart Yasso's law I should be able to run the marathon at
4h and 30min.
I am very serious about running. Thanking you in anticipation.
Mark Hutchinson wrote:
> bobbymazumder@gmail.com wrote
>
> > I am training for Marine Marathon. For long runs I am currently
> > running 16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around
> > stone mountain.
>
> How long does it take you to do one loop around the mountain?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> __________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| | |
Date: 08 Aug 2006 02:30:09
From: Dot
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
bobbymazumder@gmail.com wrote:
> For long runs I am currently running
> 16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around stone mountain.
> I almost drag myself, walk a lot after 12 miles. My goal is to run at
> least 5 twenty miler by the end of September.
Just a thought, but people who do long runs as about 50% of weekly
mileage usually do them every 2nd or 3rd week to allow adequate recovery
time. If you're intending to run/walk, then include the walks earlier
and more evenly spaced, rather than tacking them on the end. That is,
maybe insert a 1-min walk break every 30-60 min. You may find you can
then run a larger percentage of it, and recovery time will be reduced.
Or take a longer time building your long runs. For instance, if you can
run 12 mi now, then maybe run the 8 mi loop followed by 5 mi loop (I
think you refer to this later) for 13 mi. 15 mi could be 3 laps of 5 mi
loop. Or just do partial loops of the 8-mi - run 1 8-mi loop, then out 5
mi/ back 5. or whatever. But, yes, I know that sometimes picking on a
distance you can't run yet, run / walking it several times, and reducing
the walking percent also works. (I use it myself, but my paces are on
the order of 15+min/mi, so not advocating that as a way to get faster.)
I'm assuming you're running these at an effort where you can talk with
someone.
later, 26.2 wrote:
> Mark
> It takes me about 1:17 to 1:30 for each 8 mile loop.
> My intervals are 800X10 @ 4:30 for each 800 and my tempo pace is about
> 10 min/mile. With a mile of warm up and a mile of cool down.
> My weekly total was 29 miles last week.
> According to Bart Yasso's law I should be able to run the marathon at
> 4h and 30min.
Keep in mind that Yasso 800s are a *workout* (not a law) to be used in
conjunction with marathon training. If you are adequately trained for
running a marathon, then the 800s tend to be an indicator of your time.
http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,5033,s6-51-0-0-624,00.html
It sounds like you may have done the Yasso 800s without the marathon
training. Since he starts out at 4 repeats about 2 months out, and adds
1 rep each week. You're already at 10 - about 2 months out.
I would think in terms of a more linear development of your long run,
adding 5-10% every other week. 10% puts you at about 19 mi in 8 wks
(starting from 13 now). Some marathon pgms have the longest long run at
18-20 miles, but I think do it multiple times. Don't forget a taper in
there.
Are you doing any hill work or fartleks? or what other workouts are you
doing on how many days in that 29 miles?
You may need to base your marathon time goals on your long runs, rather
than Yasso 800s, since you may not have the training to make them useful
predictors. As already mentioned, you might want to change goals -
either goal time or pick a later marathon.
Just $.02 from someone a long way from marathon distance.
Dot
--
"Success is different things to different people"
-Bernd Heinrich in Racing the Antelope
|
| | |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 21:09:17
From: Mark Hutchinson
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
"26.2" <bobbymazumder@gmail.com > wrote
> Mark
> It takes me about 1:17 to 1:30 for each 8 mile loop.
You might be running more slowly then you think. According to this
website: http://www.atlantatrackclub.org/at01004.htm (Resolution
Run), the loop around the base is 5 miles long. Where are you
getting the extra 3 miles?
--
__________________
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 07:38:44
From: 26.2
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Dred,
I want to run 20 miler to get used to running and not walking. I want
to enjoy my first Marathon. I strongly feel I should run the marathon
and not walk. Thank you for your reply.
Dred wrote:
> bobbymazumder@gmail.com wrote:
> > I am training for Marine Marathon. For long runs I am currently running
> > 16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around stone mountain.
> > I almost drag myself, walk a lot after 12 miles. My goal is to run at
> > least 5 twenty miler by the end of September.
> > The course is mostly concrete and with some small climbs.
> > What can I do to run at an even pace till the end. I am 185 lbs. My
> > long runs are at 12 mins/mile. Any advice?
>
> why in the hell are you running 5 20 milers, and how do you think that
> you can run a 4:30 marathon if you are running 12 minute miles now?
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 07:34:31
From: 26.2
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Donovan,
Thank you for your reply.
Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
> On 2006-08-07, bobbymazumder@gmail.com <bobbymazumder@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Any advice?
>
> Revise your goals.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Donovan Rebbechi
> http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 13:49:35
From: Donovan Rebbechi
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
On 2006-08-07, bobbymazumder@gmail.com <bobbymazumder@gmail.com > wrote:
> Any advice?
Revise your goals.
Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 06:31:33
From: rick++
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Think about a marathon next year.
You need much more time to improve your strength.
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 12:10:00
From: Mark Hutchinson
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
bobbymazumder@gmail.com wrote
> I am training for Marine Marathon. For long runs I am currently
> running 16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around
> stone mountain.
How long does it take you to do one loop around the mountain?
--
__________________
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 04:22:39
From: Dred
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
bobbymazumder@gmail.com wrote:
> I am training for Marine Marathon. For long runs I am currently running
> 16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around stone mountain.
> I almost drag myself, walk a lot after 12 miles. My goal is to run at
> least 5 twenty miler by the end of September.
> The course is mostly concrete and with some small climbs.
> What can I do to run at an even pace till the end. I am 185 lbs. My
> long runs are at 12 mins/mile. Any advice?
why in the hell are you running 5 20 milers, and how do you think that
you can run a 4:30 marathon if you are running 12 minute miles now?
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 00:22:28
From: Kaz Kylheku
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
bobbymazumder@gmail.com wrote:
> My long runs are at 12 mins/mile. Any advice?
Sure. When you hear a "ding ding", move over to the right and make room
for the tricycling four year old.
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 22:36:28
From: BobB
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Follow the Galloway method and start walking a minute every 6 minutes from
the very beginning of your run. That way you will have something in the
tank at the end. You might want to check Jeff's book and get some pointers.
See you at the MCM.
Bob
<bobbymazumder@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:1154929415.290139.45260@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>I am training for Marine Marathon. For long runs I am currently running
> 16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around stone mountain.
> I almost drag myself, walk a lot after 12 miles. My goal is to run at
> least 5 twenty miler by the end of September.
> The course is mostly concrete and with some small climbs.
> What can I do to run at an even pace till the end. I am 185 lbs. My
> long runs are at 12 mins/mile. Any advice?
>
|
| |
Date: 07 Aug 2006 18:04:50
From: 26.2
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Mark,
Most of the people casually visiting the stone mountain do not know
about the 8 miler. The best part: it is never crowded.
Here is something from the same website:
" There are two road loops, 5 and 8 miles, that go around the mountain,
and runners start both by heading west (right, facing the railroad
tracks) on Robert E. Lee Blvd. At about two miles the loops split where
Stonewall Jackson Drive splits off to the right: 5-milers stay
straight, 8-milers take the right. The shorter loop is gently rolling,
and by staying left runners return to the parking area. The 8-miler
contains a long hill about halfway, as well as a dramatic view of the
lake. When you reach the golf course, keep left to return to Robert E.
Lee Blvd. and the railroad depot."
Thanks for your quick response. I just got a suggestion from Ed and
have decided to join
the Atlanta Track Club.
Bobby
Mark Hutchinson wrote:
> "26.2" <bobbymazumder@gmail.com> wrote
>
> > Mark
> > It takes me about 1:17 to 1:30 for each 8 mile loop.
>
> You might be running more slowly then you think. According to this
> website: http://www.atlantatrackclub.org/at01004.htm (Resolution
> Run), the loop around the base is 5 miles long. Where are you
> getting the extra 3 miles?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> __________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| | |
Date: 09 Aug 2006 02:22:15
From: Mark Hutchinson
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
"26.2" <bobbymazumder@gmail.com > wrote
> Mark,
>
> Most of the people casually visiting the stone mountain do not
> know about the 8 miler. The best part: it is never crowded.
>
> Here is something from the same website:
> " There are two road loops, 5 and 8 miles, that go around the
> mountain, and runners start both by heading west (right, facing
> the railroad tracks) on Robert E. Lee Blvd. At about two miles
> the loops split where Stonewall Jackson Drive splits off to the
> right: 5-milers stay straight, 8-milers take the right. The
> shorter loop is gently rolling, and by staying left runners
> return to the parking area. The 8-miler contains a long hill
> about halfway, as well as a dramatic view of the lake. When you
> reach the golf course, keep left to return to Robert E. Lee
> Blvd. and the railroad depot."
>
> Thanks for your quick response. I just got a suggestion from Ed
> and have decided to join
> the Atlanta Track Club.
And after you do, ask them to fix that description. The longer loop
they describe is 7 miles long, not 8. Check it out on gmaps. Better
yet, next time you are out there, clock it with your bike or car.
Report back if you find any loop that's longer than 7 miles.
Most runners use the inner loop. It's shaded, has an asphalt runners'
lane, one-way auto traffic, mile markers, and is exactly 5 miles
long.
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| | | |
Date: 09 Aug 2006 13:45:07
From: Phil M.
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
marhutch@goamil.com wrote:
> And after you do, ask them to fix that description. The longer loop
> they describe is 7 miles long, not 8. Check it out on gmaps. Better
> yet, next time you are out there, clock it with your bike or car.
> Report back if you find any loop that's longer than 7 miles.
I've never run it, but from what I can tell on motionbased.com, it's around
7.6 miles.
--
Phil M.
|
| | | | |
Date: 09 Aug 2006 23:04:56
From: Mark Hutchinson
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Phil M. said...
>
>I've never run it, but from what I can tell on motionbased.com,
>it's around 7.6 miles.
It's just under 7.1 miles. http://tinyurl.com/lczdt
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| | | |
Date: 09 Aug 2006 09:14:00
From: Piedmont Donald
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
"Mark Hutchinson" wrote:
> "26.2" wrote
>
> > Mark,
> >
> > Most of the people casually visiting the stone mountain do not
> > know about the 8 miler. The best part: it is never crowded.
> >
> > Here is something from the same website:
> > " There are two road loops, 5 and 8 miles, that go around the
> > mountain, and runners start both by heading west (right, facing
> > the railroad tracks) on Robert E. Lee Blvd. At about two miles
> > the loops split where Stonewall Jackson Drive splits off to the
> > right: 5-milers stay straight, 8-milers take the right. The
> > shorter loop is gently rolling, and by staying left runners
> > return to the parking area. The 8-miler contains a long hill
> > about halfway, as well as a dramatic view of the lake. When you
> > reach the golf course, keep left to return to Robert E. Lee
> > Blvd. and the railroad depot."
> >
> > Thanks for your quick response. I just got a suggestion from Ed
> > and have decided to join
> > the Atlanta Track Club.
>
> And after you do, ask them to fix that description. The longer loop
> they describe is 7 miles long, not 8. Check it out on gmaps. Better
> yet, next time you are out there, clock it with your bike or car.
> Report back if you find any loop that's longer than 7 miles.
>
> Most runners use the inner loop. It's shaded, has an asphalt runners'
> lane, one-way auto traffic, mile markers, and is exactly 5 miles
> long.
I measure 7.3 miles for what is described when I start close to the
railroad station. The following (which adds a small loop in the 6 to
6.5 mile area) is 7.89 miles.
http://www.usatf.org/routes/view.asp?rID=46334
I agree that, if someone runs the described course without the little
loops at 6-6.5 and 7 mile marks, they only get about 7.1 miles.
26.2, I'd suggest trying the 5 mile loop to get an accurate distance.
http://www.usatf.org/routes/view.asp?rID=31992 Don't skip the little
loop at 4 miles or you'll be short by about .2 miles. Report back on
how long these 5 miles (or better yet 10 or 15 miles) take. Then we can
make a better prediction about your marathon time.
Piedmont Donald
|
| | | | |
Date: 09 Aug 2006 23:04:26
From: Mark Hutchinson
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Piedmont Donald said...
>
>I measure 7.3 miles for what is described when I start close to
>the railroad station.
It's 7.0687 miles if you follow the course as described.
http://tinyurl.com/lczdt
>The following (which adds a small loop in the 6 to 6.5 mile area)
>is 7.89 miles. http://www.usatf.org/routes/view.asp?rID=46334 I
>agree that, if someone runs the described course without the
>little loops at 6-6.5 and 7 mile marks, they only get about 7.1
>miles.
Right. You can do extra loop-de-loops and wheelies around the
parking lot to pad the mileage, but that description doesn't tell
you that.
>26.2, I'd suggest trying the 5 mile loop to get an accurate
>distance. http://www.usatf.org/routes/view.asp?rID=31992 Don't
>skip the little loop at 4 miles or you'll be short by about .2
>miles.
That's an important little dogleg. The ATC races start and
finish near the apex of that curve. There is a start/finish line
marked out on the pavement.
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| | | | | |
Date: 10 Aug 2006 00:03:45
From: Piedmont Donald
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
"Mark Hutchinson" wrote:
> Piedmont Donald said...
> >
> >I measure 7.3 miles for what is described when I start close to
> >the railroad station.
>
> It's 7.0687 miles if you follow the course as described.
> http://tinyurl.com/lczdt
>
> >The following (which adds a small loop in the 6 to 6.5 mile area)
> >is 7.89 miles. http://www.usatf.org/routes/view.asp?rID=46334 I
> >agree that, if someone runs the described course without the
> >little loops at 6-6.5 and 7 mile marks, they only get about 7.1
> >miles.
Wow! 7.0687 miles? Really? That's so close to 7.1 miles it's uncanny.
;)
> Right. You can do extra loop-de-loops and wheelies around the
> parking lot to pad the mileage, but that description doesn't tell
> you that.
True. If it were me, I'd probably report this as a 7 mile loop. And it
is important for 26.2 since he seems to be putting a lot of emphasis on
his times for this route. Which is why I provided the link to both
routes and why I pointed out the little loops.
> >26.2, I'd suggest trying the 5 mile loop to get an accurate
> >distance. http://www.usatf.org/routes/view.asp?rID=31992 Don't
> >skip the little loop at 4 miles or you'll be short by about .2
> >miles.
>
> That's an important little dogleg. The ATC races start and
> finish near the apex of that curve. There is a start/finish line
> marked out on the pavement.
BTW, the ATC races are now run clockwise instead of counter-clockwise
as described. Caveat Emptor.
Piedmont Donald
|
| | | | | | |
Date: 10 Aug 2006 16:53:33
From: Mark Hutchinson
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Piedmont Donald said...
>"Mark Hutchinson" wrote:
>> Piedmont Donald said...
>> >
>> >I measure 7.3 miles for what is described when I start close
>> >to the railroad station.
>>
>> It's 7.0687 miles if you follow the course as described.
>> http://tinyurl.com/lczdt
>>
>> >The following (which adds a small loop in the 6 to 6.5 mile
>> >area) is 7.89 miles.
>> >http://www.usatf.org/routes/view.asp?rID=46334 I agree that,
>> >if someone runs the described course without the little loops
>> >at 6-6.5 and 7 mile marks, they only get about 7.1 miles.
>
>Wow! 7.0687 miles? Really? That's so close to 7.1 miles it's
>uncanny. ;)
Cute, but a bit misleading. There was a point to my pedantry.
The need for accuracy is being highlighted. My 7.0687 number was
juxtaposed with your initial 7.3 miles. You can round my number
off to 7.1 if you like, but not to 7.3 or 7.89. I know you are
trying to help, but the guy is already confused and you are
throwing three different numbers at him.
As a frequent racer, I feel accurate measurements are important.
Nothing pisses me off more than a mismeasured course. If this guy
is following the ATC web site's directions to run those two loops,
he's doing 14.1 miles (rounded off). He's not running 14.2, 14.6,
or 15.8 miles. Yeah, I know, it's just a training course, but if
he wants to set a realist time target for a race, he needs to
first ensure the true length of his calibration runs.
>True. If it were me, I'd probably report this as a 7 mile loop.
All right then, what are we arguing about? :-)
>And it is important for 26.2 since he seems to be putting a lot
>of emphasis on his times for this route. Which is why I provided
>the link to both routes and why I pointed out the little loops.
That's very helpful but in fact he doesn't really need to run
those detours. It's more important for him to calibrate his pace
on a measured route. He can do that just as easily on the simpler
14.1 double loop route as on the more convoluted alternatives. If
he wants to switch to the 5 mile loop, then your plot will indeed
help him include the important dog-leg extension.
>BTW, the ATC races are now run clockwise instead of
>counter-clockwise as described.
Good. Now all they have to do is reverse the direction of the
Peachtree to make running Cardiac Hill a little easier. :-)
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
|
| |
Date: 10 Aug 2006 02:30:03
From:
Subject: Re: how can I improve my Long run.
|
Dred wrote:
> bobbymazumder@gmail.com wrote:
> > I am training for Marine Marathon. For long runs I am currently running
> > 16 miles every sunday. It is two 8 miles loop around stone mountain.
> > I almost drag myself, walk a lot after 12 miles. My goal is to run at
> > least 5 twenty miler by the end of September.
> > The course is mostly concrete and with some small climbs.
> > What can I do to run at an even pace till the end. I am 185 lbs. My
> > long runs are at 12 mins/mile. Any advice?
>
> why in the hell are you running 5 20 milers
Do you know anything about training for a marathon? One of the best
known rules of thumb is that your five longest training runs should add
up to at least 100 miles.
|
|
