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Date: 29 May 2006 06:17:04
From: Dan Stumpus
Subject: Topanga 10k report
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This is one of my favorite races. For some reason, I could run with guys
who would clean my clock on flat road races. It has about 1200' of climb,
and runs in the chapparal of the beautiful Santa Monica mountains. I'd run
it in '84 and '86 in the low 38's. Here's the website:
http://www.topanga10k.com/course.html
First, let me trot out the excuses: high mileage week, a strong 2 hour run
on Thursday, and no speedwork or fast (sub 7:00/mile) downhill running due
to a kneecap injury (finally healed). There.
I lined up at the Saturday start, for old times' sake. I was hoping for sub
50, but I knew it would be tough.
The first 2.5 miles are uphill, then it's mostly flat and down. I started
out easy in about 40th place, and gradually reeled in 8 folks by the first
mile marker: 10:03, about a 500' climb. I ran comfortably hard, at about
155 hr. If my legs started to burn, I backed way off, and whenever I hit a
short, sharp rise, I chopped up my stride and slowed to maintain an even
effort.
Four or 5 guys passed me on steep uphill, but I got 'em all by the
turnaround. Don't they know they're wasting fuel charging up hills? When a
hill flattened out, I took off, and they were still recovering. My plan (as
it is on all races) was to run comfortably hard on the uphills, and put the
hurt on the flats and downs.
One young teenager would fly up the hills, then stop and walk! I've seen
this phenomena before at local mountain races. Must be something going
around...
When we hit the turnaround at 5k, it was mostly down, save for a single
gradual 200' climb. I focused on relaxing and not *trying* to run fast --
which is good, because I've got zero legspeed after 4 months of kneecap
hell. Nevertheless, I was able to muster something, and clocked 6:00/mile
on the long downhills. (A far cry from the 4:45's I could run on this
course a billion years ago). A young kid flew by me, but I caught him on
the 200' climb, then he moved ahead over the last mile. Then at mile 5, the
second woman came up on me and I just couldn't match her (sorry gals, but
that irked me!). I think she put 30+ seconds on me over the last mile.
Finally, I turned left to the famous uphill finish, about a 40' climb up to
the clock. I looked over my right shoulder to see if anybody was in view,
and it looked clear, so I eased up just a bit. Halfway up, I heard frantic
footsteps and a 20-something I'd passed on the way down blew by me. I'd
been jumped. He must have been off my left shoulder. I threw on the
afterburners and clawed my way back to him, then he moved ahead with about
20' to go, and I gave it my all, nearly falling as I leaned into the
imaginary tape, and nipped him. Note to Lance: I love this stuff!
He moved ahead of me in the chute as I caught my breath and turned his
number in before mine. I didn't think to correct it, so the official record
has him first. But hey, I got witnesses!
Net result: 51:09 (a personal worst for this distance!) 21/440, 2nd in the
50-54 (next year, I'm 55). The guy who took first in my AG was a 2:1x
marathoner who went to the Olympic Marathon Trials, so I can forget about
any woulda-shoulda-coulda's. Anyway I got a very nice engraved brass medal
to hang in my Running Shrine (which only Charlie P of this group has seen.
He bought a $2.00 candle, which really helped with the maintenance budget).
Anyway, that 51:09 is 34% slower than the last time I ran this in 38:10 as a
34 year old. Yikes! So much for the wava tables which predict about 14%
slower...The winner ran 40:30 ish this year. Now I'm fired up, and plan to
be both speed-trained and tapered next year, and hope for a 3-4 minute
improvement and top 10.
I'd forgotton how much fun these short trail races are. I'm going find some
more and use them as hard tempo runs.
-- Dan
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Date: 29 May 2006 07:25:52
From:
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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Dan Stumpus wrote:
> Anyway, that 51:09 is 34% slower than the last time I ran this in
> 38:10 as a 34 year old. Yikes! So much for the wava tables
> which predict about 14% slower.
Dan *does* look pretty old for his fifty-eight years, so this steeper
dropoff isn't such a surprise...
Hey Dan, seriously, sounds like a strong performance on that course and
given your givens. Congrats on that. Glad to hear your term in
kneecap hell is over too!
That's gotta be a beautiful course to run. I'd sure like to have run
this one with you, and there'd be no shame in reporting back to the ng
that a sixty-one year old Dan Stumpus nipped me at the line. Then we'd
head to Inn of the Seventh Whatever afterwards for post race refueling
and a bit of chanting and levitation.
Any races like this - or like something else altogether, but less than
30 km and maybe a little scenic - around say the first two or three
weeks of August?
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Date: 29 May 2006 17:30:26
From: Dan Stumpus
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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<Charlie.Pendejo@gmail.com > wrote
Thanks for your Geriatric Friendly comments :-)
> Any races like this - or like something else altogether, but less than
> 30 km and maybe a little scenic - around say the first two or three
> weeks of August?
Oooh, another Visitation? Right now all I see on
http://www.raceplace.com/crunla.shtml is a 4 miler about an hour out of town
in Snow Valley on 8/6. I'll keep my eyes peeled. On the 8/26, there's the
infamous Bulldog 25/50k (which I'll be running both laps of) in the
mountains above Malibu.
www.bulldogrun.com
Failing that, we can arrange a special tour of select scenic trails at our
reduced summer rates.
-- Dan
(ps to Doug, the photos page has a pic of Ann Langstaff slugging it out with
a tough codger)
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Date: 29 May 2006 07:47:36
From: Dot
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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Dan Stumpus wrote:
> This is one of my favorite races. For some reason, I could run with guys
> who would clean my clock on flat road races. It has about 1200' of climb,
> and runs in the chapparal of the beautiful Santa Monica mountains. I'd run
> it in '84 and '86 in the low 38's. Here's the website:
> http://www.topanga10k.com/course.html
>
> First, let me trot out the excuses: high mileage week, a strong 2 hour run
> on Thursday, and no speedwork or fast (sub 7:00/mile) downhill running due
> to a kneecap injury (finally healed). There.
Great taper ;)
...
> Four or 5 guys passed me on steep uphill, but I got 'em all by the
> turnaround. Don't they know they're wasting fuel charging up hills? When a
> hill flattened out, I took off, and they were still recovering. My plan (as
> it is on all races) was to run comfortably hard on the uphills, and put the
> hurt on the flats and downs.
>
> One young teenager would fly up the hills, then stop and walk! I've seen
> this phenomena before at local mountain races. Must be something going
> around...
It's called repeats.;) Run hard to the top, then recover - race like
they train. Did they turn around to go back down and do it again?
> Then at mile 5, the
> second woman came up on me and I just couldn't match her (sorry gals, but
> that irked me!). I think she put 30+ seconds on me over the last mile.
A difference between you and Doug ;)
>
> Finally, I turned left to the famous uphill finish, about a 40' climb up to
> the clock. I looked over my right shoulder to see if anybody was in view,
> and it looked clear, so I eased up just a bit. Halfway up, I heard frantic
> footsteps and a 20-something I'd passed on the way down blew by me. I'd
> been jumped. He must have been off my left shoulder. I threw on the
> afterburners and clawed my way back to him, then he moved ahead with about
> 20' to go, and I gave it my all, nearly falling as I leaned into the
> imaginary tape, and nipped him. Note to Lance: I love this stuff!
Must've made that 20-something's day to get nipped like that ;)
>
> He moved ahead of me in the chute as I caught my breath and turned his
> number in before mine. I didn't think to correct it, so the official record
> has him first. But hey, I got witnesses!
>
> Net result: 51:09 (a personal worst for this distance!)
Don't forget the elevation change.
> 21/440, 2nd in the
> 50-54 (next year, I'm 55). The guy who took first in my AG was a 2:1x
> marathoner who went to the Olympic Marathon Trials, so I can forget about
> any woulda-shoulda-coulda's. Anyway I got a very nice engraved brass medal
> to hang in my Running Shrine (which only Charlie P of this group has seen.
> He bought a $2.00 candle, which really helped with the maintenance budget).
cool.
>
> Anyway, that 51:09 is 34% slower than the last time I ran this in 38:10 as a
> 34 year old. Yikes! So much for the wava tables which predict about 14%
> slower...The winner ran 40:30 ish this year. Now I'm fired up, and plan to
> be both speed-trained and tapered next year, and hope for a 3-4 minute
> improvement and top 10.
Go for it!
> I'd forgotton how much fun these short trail races are. I'm going find some
> more and use them as hard tempo runs.
>
Sounds like you had fun. Thanks for the report.
Dot
--
"Success is different things to different people"
-Bernd Heinrich in Racing the Antelope
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Date: 29 May 2006 17:39:26
From: Dan Stumpus
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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"Dot" <dot.h@#duh?att.net > wrote
>> One young teenager would fly up the hills, then stop and walk! I've seen
>> this phenomena before at local mountain races. Must be something going
>> around...
>
> It's called repeats.;) Run hard to the top, then recover - race like they
> train. Did they turn around to go back down and do it again?
No, but I told the kid that the uphills don't matter, cruise 'em, and hit
the downs...
>> Then at mile 5, the second woman came up on me and I just couldn't match
>> her (sorry gals, but that irked me!). I think she put 30+ seconds on me
>> over the last mile.
>
> A difference between you and Doug ;)
She was flyin'. I think she sandbagged and jogged the first half. She
caught a guy way ahead of me, too. If I'd coached her, I'd be proud :-)
>> Finally, I turned left to the famous uphill finish, about a 40' climb up
>> to the clock. I looked over my right shoulder to see if anybody was in
>> view, and it looked clear, so I eased up just a bit. Halfway up, I heard
>> frantic footsteps and a 20-something I'd passed on the way down blew by
>> me. I'd been jumped. He must have been off my left shoulder. I threw
>> on the afterburners and clawed my way back to him, then he moved ahead
>> with about 20' to go, and I gave it my all, nearly falling as I leaned
>> into the imaginary tape, and nipped him. Note to Lance: I love this
>> stuff!
>
> Must've made that 20-something's day to get nipped like that ;)
Ya know, I didn't think about that. But as Lance Armstrong says: No Gifts.
Stay away from the Grizzlies out there! (And I'm looking out for the
Cougars over here)
-- Dan
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Date: 29 May 2006 22:12:52
From: Tony S.
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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"Dan Stumpus" <dstumpus_NOSP@mindspring.com > wrote in message
news:Alweg.6334$921.841@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> This is one of my favorite races. For some reason, I could run with guys
> who would clean my clock on flat road races. It has about 1200' of climb,
> and runs in the chapparal of the beautiful Santa Monica mountains. I'd
run
> it in '84 and '86 in the low 38's. Here's the website:
> http://www.topanga10k.com/course.html
Looks like a beautiful course.
>...
> Four or 5 guys passed me on steep uphill, but I got 'em all by the
> turnaround. Don't they know they're wasting fuel charging up hills? When
a
> hill flattened out, I took off, and they were still recovering. My plan
(as
> it is on all races) was to run comfortably hard on the uphills, and put
the
> hurt on the flats and downs.
>
> One young teenager would fly up the hills, then stop and walk! I've seen
> this phenomena before at local mountain races. Must be something going
> around...
Reminds me of myself as a 19-20 year old orienteering, stupidly blasting the
hills.
>...
> Finally, I turned left to the famous uphill finish, about a 40' climb up
to
> the clock. I looked over my right shoulder to see if anybody was in view,
> and it looked clear, so I eased up just a bit. Halfway up, I heard
frantic
> footsteps and a 20-something I'd passed on the way down blew by me. I'd
> been jumped. He must have been off my left shoulder. I threw on the
> afterburners and clawed my way back to him, then he moved ahead with about
> 20' to go, and I gave it my all, nearly falling as I leaned into the
> imaginary tape, and nipped him. Note to Lance: I love this stuff!
Way to go Dan!
> He moved ahead of me in the chute as I caught my breath and turned his
> number in before mine. I didn't think to correct it, so the official
record
> has him first. But hey, I got witnesses!
Hey man that's grounds for a fight!
> Net result: 51:09 (a personal worst for this distance!) 21/440, 2nd in
the
> 50-54 (next year, I'm 55). The guy who took first in my AG was a 2:1x
> marathoner who went to the Olympic Marathon Trials, so I can forget about
> any woulda-shoulda-coulda's. Anyway I got a very nice engraved brass
medal
> to hang in my Running Shrine (which only Charlie P of this group has seen.
> He bought a $2.00 candle, which really helped with the maintenance
budget).
Nice time for the climb.
> Anyway, that 51:09 is 34% slower than the last time I ran this in 38:10 as
a
> 34 year old. Yikes! So much for the wava tables which predict about 14%
> slower...The winner ran 40:30 ish this year. Now I'm fired up, and plan
to
> be both speed-trained and tapered next year, and hope for a 3-4 minute
> improvement and top 10.
So did you win it with a 38:10 back then? Or has the crowd gotten slower?
> I'd forgotton how much fun these short trail races are. I'm going find
some
> more and use them as hard tempo runs.
I guess Doug has some short trail races that may or not be similar, but the
traffic going up there on weekdays is prohibitive. Consider yourself lucky.
-Tony
> -- Dan
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Date: 31 May 2006 22:07:52
From: Dan Stumpus
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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"Tony S." <email_tonys@yahoo.com > wrote
>> One young teenager would fly up the hills, then stop and walk! I've seen
>> this phenomena before at local mountain races. Must be something going
>> around...
>
> Reminds me of myself as a 19-20 year old orienteering, stupidly blasting
> the
> hills.
When I started racing, I, too did the same thing.
>> Anyway, that 51:09 is 34% slower than the last time I ran this in 38:10
>> as
>> a 34 year old....
> So did you win it with a 38:10 back then? Or has the crowd gotten slower?
I ran it twice before, and the years I ran it, everyone good showed up, and
I finished 3rd and 4th, when I didn't run it, my time would have won it.
Timing is everything!
> I guess Doug has some short trail races that may or not be similar, but
> the
> traffic going up there on weekdays is prohibitive. Consider yourself
> lucky.
Yeah I pinch myself regularly -- mild weather and beautiful nearby mtns...
Thanks for your comments, good luck on your next race.
-- Dan
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Date: 30 May 2006 15:14:46
From: Teresa Bippert-Plymate
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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Dan Stumpus wrote:
> This is one of my favorite races. For some reason, I could run with guys
> http://www.topanga10k.com/course.html
>\
This looks like fun!!
> First, let me trot out the excuses: high mileage week, a strong 2 hour run
> on Thursday, and no speedwork or fast (sub 7:00/mile) downhill running due
> to a kneecap injury (finally healed). There.
Ok, you're allowed. The kneecap injury clinched it. But glad to hear
it's healed.
> One young teenager would fly up the hills, then stop and walk! I've seen
> this phenomena before at local mountain races. Must be something going
> around...
>
That seems like an odd way to waste energy!
> Net result: 51:09 (a personal worst for this distance!) 21/440, 2nd in the
> 50-54 (next year, I'm 55). The guy who took first in my AG was a 2:1x
> marathoner who went to the Olympic Marathon Trials, so I can forget about
> any woulda-shoulda-coulda's. Anyway I got a very nice engraved brass medal
> to hang in my Running Shrine (which only Charlie P of this group has seen.
> He bought a $2.00 candle, which really helped with the maintenance budget).
Yeah, but you had a lot of genuine Buts. With a knee back and the right
training again, you'll get the time down a lot! Sounds like a neat race
though! Thanks for posting. And glad to hear you got some nice metal!!
Teresa in AZ
> -- Dan
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Date: 31 May 2006 22:14:08
From: Dan Stumpus
Subject: Re: Topanga 10k report
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"Teresa Bippert-Plymate" <teresa@as.arizona.edu > wrote
>> http://www.topanga10k.com/course.html
> This looks like fun!!
As much fun as you can have with skimpy clothing on! :-)
>> One young teenager would fly up the hills, then stop and walk! I've seen
>> this phenomena before at local mountain races. Must be something going
>> around...
> That seems like an odd way to waste energy!
The thrill of passing people on the way up overcomes the logic of conserving
energy. I did the same thing in my first couple of hill races.
> Yeah, but you had a lot of genuine Buts. With a knee back and the right
> training again, you'll get the time down a lot!
Let's just say I'm motivated...
Good Training,
Dan
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